Wealth Building Blueprint – Vladyslav Grabarskyy Sep 18, 2026
With Jim Rogers, investor and chairman of Rogers Holdings
Jim Rogers has sold nearly all of the shares he owned around the world, keeping only China and Pakistan, and is holding a lot of cash.
The reason is not a forecast about the economy. It is that nearly every stock market on earth is at an all-time high at the same time, which he says has rarely happened before and has usually been followed by trouble.
"But for the most part, I've sold, because everybody's having a wonderful time, and that worries me."
Rogers has been investing for several decades, and one measure of how long is that Scott Bessent, now at the center of American economic policy, interned for him out of Yale and slept in the spare bedroom of the New York apartment Rogers used as an office.
The full interview is covered here so you can skip it.
Here are the 10 calls that matter.
Key Takeaways
He has sold nearly all of his shares around the world, keeping China and Pakistan and holding a lot of cash
Nearly every stock market is at an all-time high, which he says has rarely happened and has usually preceded trouble
He expects that a year from now things will have gotten bad, at least in some countries
The United States is the largest debtor nation in history, running the longest good market in its history since 2008
A country can have big bull markets while it declines: Britain in 1926 had huge debts and years of gains still to come
He has never sold any of his gold or silver, and buys more when the metals are in despair
Mining stocks beat owning the metal because of the leverage, though he owns none at the moment
Oil is down a lot from its all-time high, and he calls its price the most important price in the world
Curiosity and skepticism are the two qualities he names in a good investor
Scott Bessent interned for him straight out of Yale and knew nothing about finance at the time
1. Bessent Was His Intern
The interview opened on Scott Bessent, who the host said is under pressure, has told people not to bet against him because "I'm the house," and supports the $5,000 checks Donald Trump has promised if Republicans win. The connection is that Bessent worked for Rogers decades ago.
He had just graduated from Yale, planned on journalism, and asked Rogers for an internship in finance instead. Rogers had an apartment he used as an office with a spare bedroom in it, so the job came with a place to live.
What he was like at the start
He knew nothing about finance, but he was enthusiastic and eager and he wanted to learn, and he did.
Jim Rogers
2. Always Dangerous
Asked about rising bond yields and whether the situation is dangerous, Rogers refused the framing that this moment is special.
The lesson from several decades of investing
I have learned no matter what we think, there's something else going on that we don't know about yet.
Jim Rogers
It is always potentially dangerous, he said, and he has survived it so far.
3. The Largest Debtor Nation
Pressed on whether today's debt levels make it worse than decades past, Rogers took the figure at its widest.
Nothing in history compares
The United States is the largest debtor nation in the history of the world. No nation has ever been so deep in debt.
Jim Rogers
The debt rises every day and every week, and the political response is what he objects to.
Nobody is treating it as a problem
Nobody in Washington seems to understand or care.
Jim Rogers
His historical parallel is Britain, which a century ago held the same position and then went bankrupt and dealt with its own problems. Every nation, company and family that takes this path ends in trouble, he said, and then made the generational point he returns to twice in the interview.
Who pays for it
Unfortunately, it's not a good time to be a young American, because young Americans are going to face some big problems down the road.
Jim Rogers
4. This Ends Badly
The host put the policy trap to him: inflation still high, interest rates rising, debt heavy, and a government that needs employment and the stock market to stay high at the same time.
His answer was three words long
This is going to end badly. It always has.
Jim Rogers
Washington will say not to worry, he said, which is what politicians have always said.
Why he does not believe the reassurance
The market is smarter than the politicians. The market is smarter than all of us.
Jim Rogers
5. Bull Markets in Decline
Asked whether he means the stock market or the economy, Rogers said he was talking about a bigger picture, and separated the two.
A decline does not stop a bull market
No, no, no — you can have big bull markets even while you're in decline.
Jim Rogers
Britain had great bull markets on its way down, he said, and America has had them over the past few decades and is having one now. The mechanism he named is borrowing and printing.
Why it can be sustained
This has been going on for centuries. They know what to do. They know how to keep everybody happy and they know how to keep themselves happy.
Jim Rogers
He was clear about the limit of his own foresight.
He will not date the end
I don't know if it's going to end next month, or next year, or next decade. But I do know it will end someday.
Jim Rogers
The specific historical case he offered was London in 1926: Britain was the most important economy in the world, carried gigantic debts, was going into decline, and its market still did well for several more years, with fortunes made in it. He said he hopes America gets many more years of the same, because he does not want to live through the bad part.
But the run has no precedent for length
We've had the longest bull market in American history since 2008. Never in American history have we had such a long period of good markets.
Jim Rogers
Which is his argument for asking questions now
It's never been this good this long in America, and America's never been the largest debtor nation in history.
Jim Rogers
6. He Sold Nearly Everything
Asked how to navigate markets that are risky in both directions, dangerous to hold and dangerous to sit in cash while inflation runs, Rogers said what he has done rather than what anyone else should do, and prefaced it by saying he makes many mistakes.
The position
At the moment, I have sold nearly all of my shares around the world.
Jim Rogers
What triggered it
It's a rare time now — nearly every market in the world is making new highs.
Jim Rogers
What he kept
I still own Pakistan. I still own China.
Jim Rogers
And why the rest went
But for the most part, I've sold, because everybody's having a wonderful time, and that worries me.
Jim Rogers
The cash is the other side of the trade.
He is sitting in it deliberately
I have a lot of cash because I'm worried.
Jim Rogers
With a timeframe attached
I would suspect that if we were talking a year from now, things would have gotten bad, at least in some countries
Jim Rogers
Asked whether a 40-year-old Jim Rogers still building wealth would do the same, he said he hoped he would be as smart then as he thinks he is now. He has been skeptical at some points in his career and very optimistic at others, and tries to change with the times.
The test he says he would apply at any age
But I would hope that whether I was 14 or 44 or now, that I would look and say there's a lot of optimism around, there's too much optimism, I should ask questions.
Jim Rogers
7. Europe's Debts Too
Asked whether Europe is better or worse off than the United States, Rogers put it second on a percentage basis and still bad.
No large economy is clean
Most of Europe has gigantic debts, too.
Jim Rogers
Including the one with the reputation for prudence
The Germans were theoretically the prudent, well-managed economy, but even Germany has a lot of debt now.
Jim Rogers
It is hard to find a country now that does not have a lot of debt, he said.
8. Gold, Silver and Miners
Rogers owns gold and silver and has for a long time. His approach is the opposite of his approach to equities: he buys the metals when holders are unhappy.
The holding period is generational
I have never sold any of my gold and silver.
Jim Rogers
He said he hopes his children, grandchildren and great-grandchildren own it after him.
And he thinks everyone should hold some
Everybody should have some gold and silver under the bed.
Jim Rogers
His argument for why runs to the length of recorded history, by way of the 30 pieces of silver in the gospels, and the point that silver was valuable then and still is.
On his own timing
I am not a very good market timer. I may be the worst market timer in the world.
Jim Rogers
Asked about mining shares at current commodity prices, given that many mines were built when prices were far lower, he made the case for them over the metal and then explained why he does not act on it.
The miners have the leverage
They have much more leverage, and you make staggering amounts of money if you can figure out the right mining stock, the right mining company, whether it's gold or silver.
Jim Rogers
But he is not doing the work
I do not own any mining stocks at the moment, partly because I'm lazy.
Jim Rogers
He has owned them at many points in his life and assumes he will again.
9. Oil Down From Its High
On oil, after the price spiked with the Iran war and then became volatile, Rogers put the commodity at the center of everything.
Why the oil price matters more than any other
So oil is extremely important, and therefore the price of oil is perhaps the most important price of everything around the world.
Jim Rogers
And where it sits now
At the moment, the price of oil is down from its all-time high.
Jim Rogers
He guessed it was something like 50% below the high and told the host not to quote him on the figure.
The hedge he put on his own number
Don't quote me, but it's down a lot.
Jim Rogers
What he thinks someone should do about it
So if people are willing to do the work, they should consider buying some oil and gas right now.
Jim Rogers
He owns none, again on the grounds of laziness. Asked whether peace in the Middle East would push the price lower, he agreed it could, and said that is true of every asset there is: things can always get worse.
10. Curiosity and Skepticism
Asked what separates successful investors from the rest, Rogers again led with his own mistakes, then gave two words.
The two qualities
But I guess the main answer to you is curiosity and skepticism.
Jim Rogers
Curiosity makes people ask questions about the world; skepticism makes them ask questions about the answers they are given, rather than accepting that everything is always fine.
On perseverance, which the host raised
If you never give up, you're probably going to be quite successful eventually.
Jim Rogers
The last thing he wanted to add was about timing and emotion. Markets swing between despair and enthusiasm and do not behave rationally, he said, and everyone has to learn that regardless of how smart they are.
His closing warning, said twice
This is not an easy way to make money. I want to repeat that — this is not an easy way to make money.
Jim Rogers
Bonus Insights
Laziness is his stated reason for two positions he says are attractive. He owns no mining shares and no oil and gas despite arguing for both, and each time gave the same explanation rather than a valuation objection.
The host's own figure for the precious-metals correction was near $5,600 an ounce. He said the two had last spoken in January, before what he called a semi-crash, and that Rogers had told him then he had seen it before and expected a correction.
Rogers turned the advice question back on the show. Asked what people should do, he said they should watch the program, then gave his own positioning with the caveat that he makes many mistakes.
Rogers's bottom line is that the simultaneous all-time highs in nearly every market are reason enough to be out of shares and in cash, that America can keep borrowing and printing its way through a long decline with real bull markets inside it, and that gold, silver and the miners are what he intends to hold through whatever ends it.
Products, Companies & Tools Mentioned
Rogers Holdings (Rogers's own firm; he described selling nearly all his equity holdings worldwide and keeping cash, China and Pakistan)
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